Unknown Speaker 0:02
Good morning, everyone. Welcome to 30 minutes with Spyglass lending. It is May 12, Thursday right around 11 o'clock Pacific Time, we have an awesome guest today, Mandy Mosqueda. From Angel oak mortgage, she is an account executive over there. He's my account executive, actually. So I'm excited to talk to him. He is going to really educate not only myself, but everybody on what the non QM market is I get a lot of questions about this. What is going on out there? What does that even mean a non Qualified Mortgage. And I could sit here and talk for a few minutes myself, but of course, I like to hear my own voice. I'm not going to do that. We're going to pass it over to my Manny Manny, welcome to the show.

Unknown Speaker 0:39
Thanks, sir. Good morning, by the way, you have?

Unknown Speaker 0:44
Absolutely we appreciate you being here. So let's get right into it. Ken, in your own words, break down what is a non Qualified Mortgage?

Unknown Speaker 0:52
Basically, it's your you know, what agency doesn't really do. And we offer a few products for self employed borrowers where they write off too much on their tax returns. And we have a bank statement program that just requires bank statements that doesn't ask for tax returns, we don't want to see tax returns, we're using the average monthly deposits on either a 12 month or 24 month bank statement history, we do a default to expense expense ratio. But if the buyers expense ratio is actually different than what we default to. They can present that via FTP, a letter or licensed tax repair letter that states what their actual expense ratio is.

Unknown Speaker 1:39
Well, let's, let's also educate everybody, why wouldn't someone want to show a texture or w two as it were? Because a lot of when you say the word agency, let's clarify what that means as well. So can conventional lending, right? I think a lot of people think, Oh, I'm gonna go get a 30 year mortgage, a standard gold standard in mortgages, I go into a bank, or I go to a broker like I am, and they help me find that they're your mortgage, I'm giving my tax return tax returns, or I'm giving my last couple years of w two and the pay statement or excuse me, my pay stub last couple pay stubs. But in this case, that is not what you're asking for. You're asking for bank statements, why wouldn't someone want to show w two or tax returns? Well, the

Unknown Speaker 2:15
the bank statement program is meant for just self employed borrowers, w two w g, we'd have to go the full doc route, of course, to your tax returns w two is all that. But it's meant for self employed borrowers, they have to be self employed for at least two years. And self employed borrowers are typically the ones that go after higher priced properties. Therefore, higher loan amounts. Sometimes they bite off too much on their tax returns and don't qualify the agency.

Unknown Speaker 2:46
There it is, right? That's really the crux of it. You've got individuals self employed who make a great deal of money, the money is absolutely flowing in whether that is to their business bank account, or their personal account, whatever it is, they do it. But, you know, if you look at the AGI or adjusted gross income on their taxes, maybe that's all a lot lower. Why? Because they're writing off a tremendous amount against their businesses, even though the money is flowing into their accounts.

Unknown Speaker 3:12
Right. And so the cool thing about it is yes, that is all we need. Sometimes, you know, I get asked, Are you sure? I go lessons more? That's all we need to think. That's all I want to see.

Unknown Speaker 3:26
And let's go and if we can just clarify exactly what you said it was either 12 or 24 months. The difference? Let's talk a little bit about the difference between the two or the notion that you said somebody has to be self employed for at least two years,

Unknown Speaker 3:37
right. So really, it's just a difference of 8.125 and the interest rate better if you provide 24 months, but we always recommend to submit the 24 months bank statement so we can see. Sometimes the average comes out better over the course of 24 months versus the 12 months. When our bank statement review team reviews, it calculates it and provides a worksheet it'll say both the 12 and the 24 month average of monthly deposits. We can take it from there and go okay, we're gonna you know, the debt to income ratio may not work with the 24 months bank statement supplied the 12 the two and the 12 member and that's may save the deal is going to 24 Even though the rate may be you know, an entire you know, sometimes it's better because again 2020 You're talking about when you weren't 24 months bank statements those 12 months from 2020 may not be as strong as the last 12 from 2021.

Unknown Speaker 4:40
Why? What happened in 2020? Was that was that a weird year for everyone in the world or what? Everything was

Unknown Speaker 4:45
on video we were just doing everyday living every day.

Unknown Speaker 4:50
Like this like we like we are now so things don't change. So do it. Okay, and what about the difference interest rate? I mean, if somebody walks into Have a bank and they're gonna get a 30 year mortgage, they're gonna provide tax returns or W twos, you know, what kind of interest rate are they gonna get compared to what interest rate you're giving them only providing bank statements? And at what cost?

Unknown Speaker 5:11
Typically, it's about a point and a half higher. Point out maybe two points, depending on what.

Unknown Speaker 5:17
And when we use the word points. It's really percentage, right? I think for anybody who might not understand that term. Right? So if you get to, like the going rate for 30 year mortgage now, conventional lender, five, right, around five and a half percent, so might be somewhere another one and a half percent higher going bank statement loads right around there. Right, right. And let's be realistic, the cost, the cost is also higher as well, because the par rate, and what that means for a conventional loan at five and a half percent is hey, that's baked in. That's what the lender is giving you without you the borrower paying any other origination. But in a bank statement loan, not only are you going to have a higher interest rate, but there will be origination involved as well. Right?

Unknown Speaker 5:56
Right. So really, the three main differences between agency and non QM is when we still have to, there has to be an ability to repay. So that so you'll see that we offer interest only on our products, got to have a 680 FICO score minimum to have that option. We, as far as fees go, we allow up to 5% Total versus 3%. And then debt to income ratio, we go up to 50% on their total monthly obligations when you see that 43 differences there.

Unknown Speaker 6:35
Yeah, that could definitely be a big difference for sure. For a lot of people, especially self employed individuals, that's five or 7%, spread on the debt to income ratio could mean everything in terms of qualification and getting property and like you said, it often really appeals to people getting larger properties that were more expensive properties, which we know everything in LA now is doorknob is a million dollars. So you know what, what about the downpayment? I mean, what do people have to bring in for that? For a larger property, let's say they want to buy a two or $3 million property going this route, what's the down payment look like?

Unknown Speaker 7:07
So there's, you know, there's there's tiers as far as the higher you go and loan amount. We do like the higher loan amounts, because we do have a break in the interest rate, you know, either a quarter reduction, sometimes three eighths, where loan amounts that go up to say, you know, 750,000 to 2 million, or one and a half million, there'll be a drop in the interest rate. Really, we go up to 80% on those bigger loan

Unknown Speaker 7:33
amounts 80%, so that you want people bringing 20% down. Yeah, but we

Unknown Speaker 7:37
do go to 90%. On the Banks payment program. Yeah. In some scenarios where there's good, there's compensating factors. Because not every deal is the same, obviously, we can look at it and we have some solid compensating factors, like, you know, they've been self employed for a really long time. 10 plus years, they have high credit limits on their credit report. Their trade lines are high loan amounts are higher loan limits. You know, we can go to 90%. On the bank statement program with no mortgage insurance, we don't have mortgage insurance on any of our non QM products.

Unknown Speaker 8:14
See, that's awesome. That's a huge consideration. I think for a lot of people who are concerned about putting less than 20% down, or the notion that they have to put down 20%, especially in that jumbo market space. If you go conventional, if you're going a paper, it's almost a guarantee. I mean, there are some programs where you could put down less certainly, but it's almost a guarantee that you're really going to have to put down 20%. And none of that, but you need a substantial amount in reserves, right, at least for convention, let's talk about what you saw, a conventional lender is going to want to see if you're in the jumbo space, not only the downpayment of 20%, not only that you're covering the closing costs, but you also have another 12 to 18 months worth of reserves to payment to be able to make 12 to 18 months of payment. Is it the same for the non QM space?

Unknown Speaker 8:54
Yes, different different six months reserves six months, the principal interest taxes and insurance payment.

Unknown Speaker 9:01
And if there's an HOA, the HOA payment as well. Yep.

Unknown Speaker 9:05
So there's a lot

Unknown Speaker 9:05
less I mean, let's really, let's really spell it out for everybody. Right? I mean, if you let's just say the number comes out to, you know, 10 grand, that's just in principle, interest, taxes, and insurance, and then maybe an HOA 10 grand, right, because people are buying something a lot higher price, and obviously the rates are up right now. Okay, so if you've got to produce 12, or even 18 months of that on top of the down payment, you still need another 120 180 grand in there with you. It's 60 grand a big, big, big difference. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 9:33
six months worth and she's in for 30 days. Gotta be in the bank for at least 30 days.

Unknown Speaker 9:38
Right? This is a good option for a lot of people. And again, I think a lot of people may be in their mind, they look at this and like wait a second, it's already five and a half percent I'm paying another one and a half percent for this are a little bit of an origination. But you know, again, it's not the money. That's expensive. I think we should remind everybody, the money is more is reasonable. Now it was free before when it was sub 3%. It was ludicrous, right? We're back to where maybe it should be. So I want you to be paying probably, realistically, between five and 8%. For the money to borrow it. It's just that the prices are so so so high. What do you think? Do you think the price is going to come down? Are you seeing them come down anywhere?

Unknown Speaker 10:11
Yeah, they're gonna, I hope they don't come down. But as far as like home price appreciation, that's going to slow down. You've got, you've got it gets about 90% of the outstanding mortgages, right now, are at 5% or below. So home, homeowners are going to not want to refi get, you know, they're going to stay still, why would you want to get out of a 234 percent interest rate? They're going to hold on? And so yeah, there's obviously the supply of properties that are listed are gonna go down the bidding wars of, you know, properties, where believe it's six out of 10 homes that were sold 2021, late last year, I think they were sold out above this price,

Unknown Speaker 11:01
over 50% of properties. Are you talking around the country or just here in Los Angeles or somewhere around the country? I mean, that's, that's a gargantuan number 60% entered a bidding war and the other 40% You just have to assume they were termite infested checks.

Unknown Speaker 11:18
Right, so they're meant for the fixin, flip? Investor.

Unknown Speaker 11:23
Right, that's more more than realistic. Last piece of the puzzle here, we should talk about credit score, what are we talking about there? What is the minimum that you have to have to get a loan, whether that be 80% or 90%, with you?

Unknown Speaker 11:35
So the bank statement program, we were done at 600. That one, the loan to value 7%. So you've got a 600 score? You You know, you qualify to the banks and program, monthly average deposits, you put 30%, down, you put

Unknown Speaker 11:52
30% down, you have to show some a 30% plus all the closing costs for the loan plus the six months of reserves if you go net Well, again, if you're in the is that just the jumbo space, or is that for every single loan, no matter the size of the loan.

Unknown Speaker 12:04
So yeah, 600 is non QM, the minimum is 600. We have other programs like the portfolio select, which is more for your credit challenge borrowers where they had bankruptcies in the last two years. That's where that program comes in. That one also has an ITIN program. For borrowers that are itin borrowers don't have a social security number that will go up to 75%. On purchases 70% on cash out,

Unknown Speaker 12:32
let's let's pause there for a second, I think a lot of people might say, wait, you don't need a social security number to get a loan.

Unknown Speaker 12:37
Right? That's what our Aysen Brogan is we rolled that out about six months ago. You know, it's the pace on as far as applications picking up, you know, it's not like our bread and butter, but it's there. It's often you know, we offer it. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of, there's more, you know, parameters as far as like the, you know, the qualifying parameters that we required, it's higher than all the other programs we have, because, again, they don't have a source well, but yeah, we'll do it up to 75% 70%. cash out.

Unknown Speaker 13:12
Still pretty good. Now, thank you very much, I think we hit pretty much all the main points of what it is to get one of these loans or why someone wouldn't want this loan or go this route. But Angel oak itself, where what who, what, where did angel come from? I mean, this is you guys are really one of the biggest, if not the biggest non QM lender out there. How'd that come to be and who's funding you?

Unknown Speaker 13:33
So eight years ago, is when Angelo Mortgage Solutions started out back in Atlanta is where we're based out of we have three offices, but two offices mainly are the operations of headquarters in Atlanta, Georgia. And then we have Dallas, Texas, Miami. And so the end that's always done, and that's what we've done this whole time, and we do offer agency products, but the non QM like our upper management, you know, they themselves had experience trying to get loans for themselves and we're getting denied trying to do the traditional route of living said tax returns and or W choose and we're getting declined. And so they were kind of like well, we got to come up with something something that is going to be available for borrowers like us, you know, business owners that you know, we do qualify we we do have cash flow coming in. So how can we do that? And so, the guys up top, you know, that yeah, they they sort of put their heads together and came up with the banks and broken up the banks and have broken has been around, you know, back in 2005 2006 time. The bank's famous it was like a subprime credit back

Unknown Speaker 14:52
then subprime the Wild Wild West, right, right before it all blew up in 2007 2008. Right.

Unknown Speaker 14:58
So you know, I Remember back then, because I was in the business back then too.

Unknown Speaker 15:04
Don't say this to people might be watching this thinking that we're 28? You know, I don't know.

Unknown Speaker 15:09
Maybe you started when you were five? Yeah. And it's just, again, it was just something that it was just how can we be an outlier? How can we set ourselves apart from other lenders? Where people are just? I mean, we still have it today? Well, we have, you know, realtors and other loan officers that don't know much about it. For some reason, they think non QM is subprime, which it's definitely not, it's definitely not our average FICO score 760.

Unknown Speaker 15:36
Let's pause on that for a second, I think people need to really let that sink in the average score 760. You know, again, anybody who doesn't know about this stuff, they think, Oh, you go to a bank, you get a 30 year mortgage, that's it. Either you qualify or you don't. And either you're quote unquote worthy, or you shouldn't be getting a mortgage, or this is the problem with what's going on in the country, because everybody, right, but that's not really the case, the 760 to get a 760 score, your pristine, you really have your your A beyond creditworthy borrower, you know, because people in the high 60s are decent score, low 70s 760 plus your pristine borrower, for the most part, right, and you have the money, you're showing the money coming into your bank account, and you're a longtime business owner making good money, you're absolutely worthy of a loan, and you absolutely deserve to own a house, just like everybody else, even though, you know, you might be smart enough to deduct a lot more against your taxes legally, of course, that doesn't necessarily show show up on the ledger the same way as it does through your bank statements. Correct? I mean, what's the default rate? If you don't mind sharing? Or can you share? You know, I mean, is it is it just?

Unknown Speaker 16:43
I'm not sure on that. I mean, our loans get when you were saying that they go to like that AAA is the standard of what we want, our loans have to go when they get, you know, sold off in the secondary market. Right. But that's, that's, you know, we say we're flexible, but yet, it's still got to make sense. And it's so again, that ability to repay has to be there. So like I said, we're not subprime. We still have a requirement of, you know, close to, I want to say close to agency. But, you know, like you said, like I said, early compensating factors are a big thing, if it doesn't fall within what our guidelines say, you know, but

Unknown Speaker 17:30
what about, but what about secondary or investment properties?

Unknown Speaker 17:35
So that's another big one. With us, is our debt service coverage ratio program, the DSCR. We call it investor cashflow. Wait, before we

Unknown Speaker 17:45
get into that, and DSCR, I mean, I love this product more than anything, and we're going to touch on this for a couple of minutes. But can you use a bank statement program to get a secondary home or investment property? Or does it have to be DSCR?

Unknown Speaker 17:57
The be the banks can program we do offer non owner occupied? Yeah, that but our DSCR program, the difference there is that it's a no income, no employment verification loan.

Unknown Speaker 18:09
Even better, you don't have to show bank statements at all right? Show me the lease or the market rents, that they're good enough that's out there, if we can, if you can show that the market rents are going to cover it and that ratio, we're talking about, usually one to one, or, you know, some lenders have 1.2 to one, or are you one to one

Unknown Speaker 18:28
1.0 That ratio, but we actually have flexibility on that if they don't meet now, the debt service coverage ratio is the, you know, the rent, divided by the principal interest tax and insurance. So 1.0 is meaning that they're breaking even, you know, anything above 1.0 is solid because they're making money. Now we do offer, if it is below one point out, we're not going to decline the loan automatically. If they have a 700 FICO score, we do allow that it's below. There's a hit to the rate, the interest rate, but it's doable, we still will offer it as long as they have a 700 score.

Unknown Speaker 19:06
Let's put this in perspective a little bit more, I'm going to drill down for a second here. So what we're saying is, as a real estate investor, don't show tax returns w two or your bank statements, right, show us that the cash flow, you're getting the lease that's already in place, whether this is a purchase or cash out, or just the market rents that we can substantiate the appraisal is there to cover you one to one, okay, so your principal interest taxes insurance on the payment we're about to give you on your new loan is going to be covered by that cash flow the market rents and you're saying even if it's not even if it's a little bit lower, we're still going to give you the loan if you've got a good credit score. Again, you might take a little bit hit to the rate, but it's still opportunity to pick up the property, especially here in Southern California, which is a big thing. Because a lot of people play the appreciation game or you know, or they'll take a couple of different types of products. This is not just 30 year fixed interest only products are offered for this long term interest only. And this is the big thing for this because, you know, somebody says, Well, why all the sudden DSCR? This, this big product that came out? Yeah, it's long term financing for real estate investors for the longest time, they had shorter term financing three, five year loans, or it was extremely hard to get them or you gotta get them into commercial banks, or they're going private money, and they're constantly paying extension fees, because private money is really built for short term money. Right? These are amazing long term options. And it's going up pretty high on the on the loan to value ratio of 75, even 80%. Right, on both purchases and refinances. Right. That's,

Unknown Speaker 20:38
that's the thing. We're trying to keep our industry strong. And that's what in the non GM space, you know, we maxed out at 80% on this DSCR product. Yeah, you know, the bank statement program? Yes, we go to nine, you know, am I but yet there's a big bump and rate, once you go down from 80 to 8585 to 90, you're not so much discouraged. But again, it's like, we want the bars to bring in, you know, a solid downpayment, because that was our problem 15 years ago, is that everybody went 100% at 20, not everybody, but I mean, that's what I saw a lot of new ones coming out. And once once values kind of, you know, stay and stay still, and they stop increasing, then people kind of kind of got stuck, you know, they couldn't revive, they couldn't do any sort of cash out refinance, or anything like that. If they did a rate and term that rates are higher, you know, trying to get a new loan versus the what they have at the present time. Yep. So yeah, I mean, the the program, the DSCR program on investor, cash flow is pretty much a credit report, and the appraisal,

Unknown Speaker 21:44
amazing, you know, there's gonna be conditions. Other than that, you got to show a few other things to really get these, obviously, but to your point, yeah, it is, it is that easy. And sometimes you need a second appraisal, but for the most part have done and done correctly, you can do these loans in two to three weeks, a really wonderful option for real estate investors. Let's talk about many Mosqueta for a second, how did you get in the business? Where do you start?

Unknown Speaker 22:08
Back in 2002? So

Unknown Speaker 22:11
I went to when you were five, like you said you were five? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 22:15
So I went to California Lutheran University in 1000, oaks, and my major was business finance. So back then in the late 90s, early 2000s, you know, people, a lot of people wouldn't, you know, in the business program that we were all thinking they want to be financial advisors, you know, stockbrokers that I entered my last spring semester of my senior year for a financial advisor, and I was like, this is kind of boring. Even though I studied for it, I was like, Oh, this is kind of boring. And then, you know, our professors, my professors brought up you know, what, what was going on in the real estate market? And, you know, my family, I grew up in the real estate business because of my family, because my folks

Unknown Speaker 22:58
and what they do if we can, if we can get into every second,

Unknown Speaker 23:01
your real estate agent, yep, you know, investing in pop by folks investing in real estate, and so, I was there with them at literally as a 567 year old, like, doing things were, you know, purchasing rehab loans or fixing systems. You really didn't get into this purchase and hold and yeah. Being like the, you know, the, you know, it was a problem and to go fix it and, you know, whatever it was on call, I pretty much it was on call, you know, even in college, hey, come fix this problem, whatever, whatever. But, yeah, so I kind of knew already about what the business was about. But the lending side, it was new to me. So at that time, this was booming. 2002 any lender you went with, I mean, they were busy.

Unknown Speaker 23:53
2002 is, I mean, that was the year when it really exploded, right? Like all of a sudden, everything was the appraisals were rubber stamping, notaries were making $300 a pop signing it, Ameriquest and countrywide. Were the biggest lenders in the country and just be like, everybody gets a you get a house and you get a house.

Unknown Speaker 24:16
Yeah. So I mean, and then there was banks, you know, new banks popping up left and right at that time, for the next like, say, three, four years.

Unknown Speaker 24:26
Thanks, quote, unquote, banks will call for lack of a better word. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 24:30
wait, you're welcome into a broker's office. So that's pretty much all I've done is wholesale. And wholesale being that you know, my clients are the brokers. You know, I'd walk in and they'd give me a show me four or five other pre qual letters from lenders I've never heard of, and with aggressive rates, and I go, wow, okay. And that's how it was back then. So it was you better answer your phone or call them back, you know, within the hour because there's five other contact us You know, knocking on their door looking for business? And so yeah, 2002 and then pretty much, you know, till the wheels fell off in 2008 kind of did that and then later on got into private money.

Unknown Speaker 25:20
Later I mean, it let's pause its efforts I'm going to add to designate what exactly did you do when the quote unquote wheels fell off? Right? The financial markets blew up, subprime, you know, if people don't remember, but subprime blew up in 2007. Right, the, you know, the fact that the economic crisis hit in 2008, September 2008, was when the Dow dropped and it was a mid September Lehman Brothers bankrupt, blah, blah, blah. And that was the end of that year, everybody remembers the devastation that we slid into 2009 all, you know, tail between our legs, but 2007, mid 2007 was really when the debt, you know, are those subprime lenders started feeling the heat and started quickly bringing their wholesale channels down and, and stopping with the, with the types of lending. So for the rest of us in that industry in early 2008, the writing was on the wall. So what were you doing when when it was hard to start doing those loans? Again? Where did you go for the next couple of years?

Unknown Speaker 26:11
Then I went to the other side of I became an REO asset manager. foreclosures.

Unknown Speaker 26:18
explain to the listeners to the viewers, what is an REO at first what what is REO stands for?

Unknown Speaker 26:23
So real estate owned. So basically, it was it was like, being an account executive you ever signed, you know, four or five banks or lenders that had loans that went into default that were going into foreclosure? So you worked with real estate agents? To

Unknown Speaker 26:42
really I mean, what you're saying is it actually went all the way through the foreclosure process, right. So it became reo, it'd be to the bank, literally, the property that became real estate, what's known as REO real estate. Okay,

Unknown Speaker 26:55
so I worked for an outsourcer that had all these, you know, banks that they worked with, so we'd be assigned different banks, and you had your contact, and then basically, you would find the real estate agents in the area that the property was located. You know, you build relationships with your real estate agents, and worked with the ones that were solid, and were reliable. Because it you, their first job was, hey, I got a property for you, I need you to go take a look at it. Let me know what it looks like. Because we need to get on it. You know, if there's bars, or if there are tenants in there, or the the previous homeowner is still there, we need to get them out ASAP. So you got to work with them either offer a Cash for Keys, or, you know, if they didn't want to leave, it's Hey, gotta wait till the sheriff shows up. And then there'll be

Unknown Speaker 27:40
that terminal while Cash for Keys. No, I still we still hear it. Right. I think a lot of investors still use that as much as possible. If they're gonna buy something that has a long term tenant in there saying, hey, we want we want you out for whatever reason, and avoiding eviction, avoiding, you know, a lengthy process, say, here's a tremendous amount of money, because that's really what it takes these days to give us your keys. So we can do something else with the property. Go on.

Unknown Speaker 28:02
So yeah, and just do that processes. You're just you've had then now you have your subcontractors or your actual contractor that depending on how messy The house was left, or if it was turnkey, where it was ready to be basically your basic paint, paint the walls and vacuum and mop the floors or whatever, and do a little bit of landscaping, and then we can list it to then all of a sudden, like a giant rehab budget that was going to take through three months, you had to didn't become like the project manager on that as well. So basically, and then your job was to get it listed and sold. And my job was to look at offers and say if you'd accept it or not, and then get it in escrow. And hopefully, hopefully, we got cash offers those were the quickest ones to close.

Unknown Speaker 28:48
Right. Back then there was still cash offers. All right, so we got just a couple minutes left. After that, how long did you do the reo? And then when did you get back into lending

Unknown Speaker 28:57
as yours? And then I worked in the beer industry.

Unknown Speaker 29:00
Nice. There we go. That's we finally got to the heart of it where we're at.

Unknown Speaker 29:04
So it was Brian and Ken USA. And then I would put Anheuser Busch, so the big the two big dogs

Unknown Speaker 29:11
did that for six years as a district manager handling different distributors throughout Southern California, all the way up to the Central Coast. And then it was I heard, you know, the mortgage business was coming back. I always said I was never gonna do it. To be honest,

Unknown Speaker 29:28
I said the same thing. Yeah. What year are we in right now? Right? Where was it when you heard and I like the idea of hearing about it. Like there were whispers in the air of the mortgage business is compelling. 16 was

Unknown Speaker 29:39
some of my counterparts that I had back on the first on the first run. We're getting back into it and some that stayed the whole time. Yeah. Hey, this is picking up again. And I still think it took me about a year to like, finally say okay,

Unknown Speaker 29:54
Manny, we need you. Manny come back home and call you back. So okay, so you're so you're and it was Angelo Comey. Earlier, we were going somewhere else first.

Unknown Speaker 30:01
I know that's when I got into private money lending. Oh, yeah. Right. You mentioned that did just bridge loans. So that one year purchase Angeles. And then they actually did new construction. And then I was at City financial, that did the same thing purchase and rehab and also do rental loans. And then over a year, a little over a year ago, I started with Angelo.

Unknown Speaker 30:23
Yeah, which is a good time to do it. Because I think, you know, to put it in perspective, through the pandemic non QM was one of the first things to just go away real fast. So, you know, 2020, not so much. But all of a sudden, when everybody realized that things aren't as bad as they're going to be, I mean, the stock market got crushed, obviously, for a short period of time, and they started coming back and everybody realized, like, nothing was falling off a cliff. Everything's coming back. The markets coming back, the real estate market is not falling off a cliff. Certainly. So non QM quickly came back in the space, and then especially the DSCR product became so hot, because everybody also realize the rentals are still going on, right? I mean, now it's defaulting isn't all blowing up. And not only that, but the rates are rising. So what a great product to start lending on. And here we are. And now you're at an amazing place. I mean, Angel oak, again, one of the biggest, should continue on for quite some time now, across the board, and congratulations to you for Lana and had a great place and for being my rep, by the way, congratulations for having to deal with me constantly.

Unknown Speaker 31:17
I love working with you. And, you know, to continue their relationship, because we've got a lot of business to get. Yeah, I mean, to piggyback on what you said about the investing side, the investor side, you know, about almost 30% of the purchases in March of this year, were done by investors, you know, and rent still increasing. Yep. It's gone up, I think 12 13% since 2021. So rents going up. Investors are more investors are purchasing right now.

Unknown Speaker 31:50
Yep. Much to the dismay of of many people in this country. And you know what, we won't necessarily argue with them. But hey, this is our side of the fence. We'll probably just keep doing what we're doing. So many Mosqueda from Angel account executive at Angel oak Mortgage Solutions, greatly appreciate you joining us today. Thank you very much. And you and I will be back on the phone shortly. I'm sure running scenarios. I've talked. Alright, take care. You too. Thank you.